Which League Was Better: WUSA or WPS?
Both leagues lasted three years. I am curious to know which you think was a better league, the WUSA (2001-2003) or WPS (2009-2011).
I am going to say that the WUSA was better. The talent and the competition were more interesting to me.
Dave
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on -
Strange question. What is its purpose? The answers might be classified under:
-- median attendance or income per match
-- mean attendance or income per match
-- reasons for folding
Talent do not count for nuffink as shown by Bern 1954.
"more interesting"? What does that mean in AV English?
The reality is that both went the way of the Dodo. Other countries´ leagues may be limping along, hardly keeping their snouts above water, but how come a country where it is exceedingly common for girls to play football, these leagues vanished? More relevant, what lessons were learnt? How are they applied in 2012?
With team names like the Houston Dynamo and the Chicago Red Stars it sounds as if ladies´ soccer is communism by the back door.
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Permalink Reply by DaveBrett on -
Houston Dynamo is a men's team, not a women's team. WUSA attendance was better, which is part of why it was a better league. Yes, it is exceedingly common for girls (and boys) to play soccer here. But just because people play it doesn't mean they want to watch it.
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Permalink Reply by Women's Soccer United on -
Why do you think both leagues did not exceed the three years? Do you think that the attendance in the WPS suffered because of the travel distance? I would imagine it is expensive (and long hours) to be able to follow your favourite team round all season.
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on
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Maybe the sponsors signed on for 3 years and when they did not renew, the houses of cards that was built on sand folded?
Whatever lesson might have been learned from the earlier failure does not seem to have been applied to the second effort. Third time lucky?
Women's Soccer United said:Why do you think both leagues did not exceed the three years? Do you think that the attendance in the WPS suffered because of the travel distance? I would imagine it is expensive (and long hours) to be able to follow your favourite team round all season.
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Permalink Reply by DaveBrett on
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Both leagues failed for the same reason: there aren't enough fans of women's soccer to sustain the kind of salaries they were paying the players. The next women's soccer league in this country will have to be semi-professional. A few of the best players will be paid, but most of the players will only receive a small allowance. That's how it is going to have to be.
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on
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Attendance may have been better, but did it pay for itself? It has been claimed that attendance at this year´s UEFA ladies´ CL final was up by >75%. What mattered was that attendance had increased by ca 22 000. Had it been an increase of 22, who would have cared?
Briefly, ladies´ football in USA needs to decide what job the product of (professional) ladies´ football is meant to do. Then it needs to define who could be persuaded to buy that product. With bums on seats, sponsors will join the party.
Another way to look at it is that in American college sport, the Final Four for ladies means basket ball. Why is there not a Final X that means women´s soccer such as a Final Eight? The common game for the world is football and USA has been a dominant force in ladies´ football for years and staged several world cups, including the best attended and the most profitable -- yet the USA cannot organise itself around a sport it has been dominating. Bizarre.
The business of America is business. Sell the world game to Americans!
DaveBrett said:Houston Dynamo is a men's team, not a women's team. WUSA attendance was better, which is part of why it was a better league. Yes, it is exceedingly common for girls (and boys) to play soccer here. But just because people play it doesn't mean they want to watch it.
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Permalink Reply by DaveBrett on
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I don't think ANY fans travelled to away matches. The distances in America are too great.
Women's Soccer United said:I would imagine it is expensive (and long hours) to be able to follow your favourite team round all season.
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on
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Most of the men´s leagues in Europe have been and still are semi-professional. Only a few, like the Italian, Spanish, German and English can afford fully professional men´s leagues. The ladies´ teams in all the countries are semi-amateur, except for a few like Lyon and Frankfurt. The evolution of the ladies´ CL in Europe illustrates how soccer is going there.
DaveBrett said:Both leagues failed for the same reason: there aren't enough fans of women's soccer to sustain the kind of salaries they were paying the players. The next women's soccer league in this country will have to be semi-professional. A few of the best players will be paid, but most of the players will only receive a small allowance. That's how it is going to have to be.
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on
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Maybe try regionalised leagues? With one all-embracing Cup with 2 teams from each state and 28 wild cards?
DaveBrett said:I don't think ANY fans travelled to away matches. The distances in America are too great.
Women's Soccer United said:I would imagine it is expensive (and long hours) to be able to follow your favourite team round all season.
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Permalink Reply by Women's Soccer United on
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Semi-pro would be good, they are on the second season of a semi-pro league in England. The attendances are not huge but I don't think the league is reliant on ticket sales to be able survive.
DaveBrett said:Both leagues failed for the same reason: there aren't enough fans of women's soccer to sustain the kind of salaries they were paying the players. The next women's soccer league in this country will have to be semi-professional. A few of the best players will be paid, but most of the players will only receive a small allowance. That's how it is going to have to be.
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Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on
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A few years ago Chelsea Ladies section of the football club had its financial support cut down. John Terry (of all people) put his hand in his pocket, according to the Guardian newspaper, and persuaded some of the other Chelsea male players to do the same. Being dependent on a male club is not always straight forward. The ladies repaid him by making Terry their President.
As regards attendances at ladies´ matches in Europe, please see another discussion in the WSU. Briefly, figures in Germany have slowly been rising but they are still below those in Sweden (a country of about 1/10th the population) about 7-10 years ago, and both countries average more than the Brits do. Roll on the Olympic tournament.
Women's Soccer United said:Semi-pro would be good, they are on the second season of a semi-pro league in England. The attendances are not huge but I don't think the league is reliant on ticket sales to be able survive.
DaveBrett said:Both leagues failed for the same reason: there aren't enough fans of women's soccer to sustain the kind of salaries they were paying the players. The next women's soccer league in this country will have to be semi-professional. A few of the best players will be paid, but most of the players will only receive a small allowance. That's how it is going to have to be.
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Permalink Reply by Sebastian Kanty on -
1. semi-pro league.
2. a big NO to players in the USWNT, to skip regular games in the league. it's ok, for a game or two, but the US team have some ridiculous demands. if a team signs a player for its rooster, they want the player to be eligible to play the games in the leagues schedule. if you get a great player like alex morgan, you do want her to play for the team and win the title. that's not gonna happen if the call for the WNT keeps ringing 6-8 times a year. and the us camps seems to be far more and longer than other countries. this might work in a league with only 6 teams, but even if it does, those teams misses their players and the fans do to. (example, Christen Press got a call yet again from the US to go to another assembly with the USWNT, but Göteborg FC said no. If they would have agreed, she would again miss atleast a league game and a cup game. That would mean that she would have missed 1/3 of the games to this date. The club/team pays her to play for them, and if the schedule and position in the league allows it they allow her to attend camps and miss games. if Christen would have attended the assembly, she would have only been in sweden for 2,5 weeks since her last camp in the us.
3. promotion for the league/team in tv/radio and/or internet (to "drag" people to the stadiums)
4. sponsors, if you have an attendance, you will have sponsors...so no 3 plays a big role in achieving no 4.
as i have read and understood it, 5 players in the USWNT gets 70,000$, 10 players gets 50,000$, and the rest will get about 30,000$ and less when they have a contract with US Soccer. these figures are from last year i think, don't remember where i read it. say wambach gets 70K, she won't mind missing some games in magicjack, since she already has 70K in the bank. but what does it do to the team and league...i would say it suffers, because the league lacks one the big poster-names, and that will make an impact on attendance.
as a sidenote, when the swedish wnt was in germany, they got 140 SEK a day, that's 19,5$ a day. they are only paid for the days they are in the national team, not on year basis. so in sweden it doesn't pay to miss out league games, the reward is only the honor for representing your country, besides a measily ~20 bucks..
---- well i'm drunk and sleapy now...see ya'll later.. ----
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