Olympique Lyon Still Top with just one game to play French Féminine Division 1, 27th May 2012

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on May 28, 2012 at 22:16

But it is still just Lyon, isn´t it?  Just like Umeå carried the Swedish colours proudly into battle for many years. OK Djurgården/Älvsjö reached one CL final, so maybe there were two strings to Sweden´s bow.

Have the spectators per game been going up, like in Germany? Or, is it more like Sweden (and the UK possibly), fallen off a bit and stagnated?  Maybe it is turnover we should be measuring, not bodies?

Richard Murray said:

How has french clubs and international soccer grown on the womens side?

OL. OL has single handedly made womens soccer serious in France and other clubs whether for envy or the economic probability charts are following as strong as they can.

Why has the french come to the forefront of womens soccer?

You said it yourself, in mens soccer French clubs have designed themselves to be support clubs, economically of a lower tier inable to compete with the big boys. France is using their grand development system but using money in the womens ahead of the game so that many french teams will be on the list of best female teams 20 years from now.

Lars Breimer said:

Germany has long been a powerhouse in ladies´ football even if the attendance at their league matches leaves a lot to be desired though they are on a rising curve to be fair, but how do you explain the rise of France both a club level and internationally? (I think you are slightly overoptimistic in your prediction of a French win at the Olympics, but dream big.)

I look at Forbes valuation of the most valuable European soccer teams (male). In the top 20 there are 6 English, 5 Italian, 4 German, 3 Spanish and 2 French teams, but when you restrict it to the top 12 you are left with 5 Eng, 3 Ita plus 2 each from Esp & Ger. Another way to look at it is by operating income. Those >$75M are 3 from Eng and 2 each from Esp & Ger, while if you restrict it to >$100M then you are left with Man Utd, Real Madrid & Schalke. Man Utd shut down their women's division in 2005; I do not know what the other two do for the fair sex.

But, why have the French come to the fore in ladies' football?

Richard Murray said:

Importance of matches, eurosport is like an ESPN of european sport. the importance of the matches is why, which is why FFF need to stream womens matches like the DFB

Lars Breimer said:

Is this Eurosport televising a result of the importance of the matches?  Or, does Eurosport show a lot of ladies´ football anyway?

Richard Murray said:

The OL/Juvisy and PSG/Montpellier will both be on eurosport.The online streams will have it then for anyone who is outside europe.

link

Women's Soccer United said:

Going to be a fantastic day! I have heard it will be televised, will get confirmation asap.

Lars Breimer said:

Is the match going to be televised?

Richard Murray said:

june 2nd, what a day:)

Permalink Reply by Richard Murray on May 30, 2012 at 3:51

we should measure turnover but that takes time. Man United wasn't a sensation over night. AC Milan, Boca Juniors didnt start out as they are. Womens clubs need time, that is it. and that is the problem of womens soccer in the  USA.
Real is over a hundred years old. OL Feminin professionally isnt. In 20 years UEFA womens clubs will have a truly professional history and that iwll culminate into greater fanbase and etc.
time, stick around long enough and a game played by ivy league colleges without truly protective gear will become an economic engine, that being the NFL.



Lars Breimer said:

But it is still just Lyon, isn´t it?  Just like Umeå carried the Swedish colours proudly into battle for many years. OK Djurgården/Älvsjö reached one CL final, so maybe there were two strings to Sweden´s bow.

Have the spectators per game been going up, like in Germany? Or, is it more like Sweden (and the UK possibly), fallen off a bit and stagnated?  Maybe it is turnover we should be measuring, not bodies?

Richard Murray said:

How has french clubs and international soccer grown on the womens side?

OL. OL has single handedly made womens soccer serious in France and other clubs whether for envy or the economic probability charts are following as strong as they can.

Why has the french come to the forefront of womens soccer?

You said it yourself, in mens soccer French clubs have designed themselves to be support clubs, economically of a lower tier inable to compete with the big boys. France is using their grand development system but using money in the womens ahead of the game so that many french teams will be on the list of best female teams 20 years from now.

Lars Breimer said:

Germany has long been a powerhouse in ladies´ football even if the attendance at their league matches leaves a lot to be desired though they are on a rising curve to be fair, but how do you explain the rise of France both a club level and internationally? (I think you are slightly overoptimistic in your prediction of a French win at the Olympics, but dream big.)

I look at Forbes valuation of the most valuable European soccer teams (male). In the top 20 there are 6 English, 5 Italian, 4 German, 3 Spanish and 2 French teams, but when you restrict it to the top 12 you are left with 5 Eng, 3 Ita plus 2 each from Esp & Ger. Another way to look at it is by operating income. Those >$75M are 3 from Eng and 2 each from Esp & Ger, while if you restrict it to >$100M then you are left with Man Utd, Real Madrid & Schalke. Man Utd shut down their women's division in 2005; I do not know what the other two do for the fair sex.

But, why have the French come to the fore in ladies' football?

Richard Murray said:

Importance of matches, eurosport is like an ESPN of european sport. the importance of the matches is why, which is why FFF need to stream womens matches like the DFB

Lars Breimer said:

Is this Eurosport televising a result of the importance of the matches?  Or, does Eurosport show a lot of ladies´ football anyway?

Richard Murray said:

The OL/Juvisy and PSG/Montpellier will both be on eurosport.The online streams will have it then for anyone who is outside europe.

link

Women's Soccer United said:

Going to be a fantastic day! I have heard it will be televised, will get confirmation asap.

Lars Breimer said:

Is the match going to be televised?

Richard Murray said:

june 2nd, what a day:)

Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on May 30, 2012 at 6:08

The NFL owes it success to one gifted man -- Pete Rozelle. His vision and drive took the NFL from something trivial to a dominant position in sport. Unfortunately, neither UEFA nor FIFA had their Rozelle when they needed him or her. Instead of learning from the NFL they went the route of baseball, to use an American analogy.

Maybe it was Lyon´s Ladies fortune that the gentleman who took over the club and settled its debts also was interested in supporting ladies´ soccer. Maybe German clubs are being stung by their ladies´ pancake last year which had consequences for this year. But I am not persuaded that lady soccer players have time. They must get their sisters to support them to get bums on seats.

It probably costs about €3M a year to run a top ladies club, including a U-19, U-17 and U-15 development program. This is not a lot of money in sporting terms but it cannot realistically be defrayed by money at the gate but needs subsidizing. The NBA has subsidized the WNBA for years but the NBA is wealthier than the English Premier League.

Ladies soccer must grow their market. Like Pete Rozelle revolutionized sport 50 years ago, so someone in ladies´ football needs to find the key to the golden door. It needs a great marketeer and visionary, else the professional game will be gone within 5 years.

Richard Murray said:

we should measure turnover but that takes time. Man United wasn't a sensation over night. AC Milan, Boca Juniors didnt start out as they are. Womens clubs need time, that is it. and that is the problem of womens soccer in the  USA.
Real is over a hundred years old. OL Feminin professionally isnt. In 20 years UEFA womens clubs will have a truly professional history and that iwll culminate into greater fanbase and etc.
time, stick around long enough and a game played by ivy league colleges without truly protective gear will become an economic engine, that being the NFL.



Lars Breimer said:

But it is still just Lyon, isn´t it?  Just like Umeå carried the Swedish colours proudly into battle for many years. OK Djurgården/Älvsjö reached one CL final, so maybe there were two strings to Sweden´s bow.

Have the spectators per game been going up, like in Germany? Or, is it more like Sweden (and the UK possibly), fallen off a bit and stagnated?  Maybe it is turnover we should be measuring, not bodies?

Richard Murray said:

How has french clubs and international soccer grown on the womens side?

OL. OL has single handedly made womens soccer serious in France and other clubs whether for envy or the economic probability charts are following as strong as they can.

Why has the french come to the forefront of womens soccer?

You said it yourself, in mens soccer French clubs have designed themselves to be support clubs, economically of a lower tier inable to compete with the big boys. France is using their grand development system but using money in the womens ahead of the game so that many french teams will be on the list of best female teams 20 years from now.

Lars Breimer said:

Germany has long been a powerhouse in ladies´ football even if the attendance at their league matches leaves a lot to be desired though they are on a rising curve to be fair, but how do you explain the rise of France both a club level and internationally? (I think you are slightly overoptimistic in your prediction of a French win at the Olympics, but dream big.)

I look at Forbes valuation of the most valuable European soccer teams (male). In the top 20 there are 6 English, 5 Italian, 4 German, 3 Spanish and 2 French teams, but when you restrict it to the top 12 you are left with 5 Eng, 3 Ita plus 2 each from Esp & Ger. Another way to look at it is by operating income. Those >$75M are 3 from Eng and 2 each from Esp & Ger, while if you restrict it to >$100M then you are left with Man Utd, Real Madrid & Schalke. Man Utd shut down their women's division in 2005; I do not know what the other two do for the fair sex.

But, why have the French come to the fore in ladies' football?

Richard Murray said:

Importance of matches, eurosport is like an ESPN of european sport. the importance of the matches is why, which is why FFF need to stream womens matches like the DFB

Lars Breimer said:

Is this Eurosport televising a result of the importance of the matches?  Or, does Eurosport show a lot of ladies´ football anyway?

Richard Murray said:

The OL/Juvisy and PSG/Montpellier will both be on eurosport.The online streams will have it then for anyone who is outside europe.

link

Women's Soccer United said:

Going to be a fantastic day! I have heard it will be televised, will get confirmation asap.

Lars Breimer said:

Is the match going to be televised?

Richard Murray said:

june 2nd, what a day:)

Permalink Reply by Richard Murray on June 2, 2012 at 10:21

well the NFL has the NCAA which would be an illegal organization in Europe. You have to see, NFL teams get to have secret deals with NCAA clubs, some that bigger than NFL clubs in terms of Revenue but their financial data is very private and secret.
The WNBA is subsidized heavily by the NBA, but the WNBA's biggest problem is two fold. consider the top 10 female athletes by money. Only the Williams Sisters are true legends of their sport. Danica Patrick isn't a great driver. Sharapova isnt' a great tennis player. But, they make a lot of money. So, in many ways, the media , which is owned totally by men, who own most of the shares of the corporations, helps to hurt womens soccer and womens basketball which require a different tact media wise

Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on June 3, 2012 at 16:00

Fair points.  Which media do you think might take up cudgels for ladies´ soccer?  Cosmopolitan?  Elle?

Richard Murray said:

well the NFL has the NCAA which would be an illegal organization in Europe. You have to see, NFL teams get to have secret deals with NCAA clubs, some that bigger than NFL clubs in terms of Revenue but their financial data is very private and secret.
The WNBA is subsidized heavily by the NBA, but the WNBA's biggest problem is two fold. consider the top 10 female athletes by money. Only the Williams Sisters are true legends of their sport. Danica Patrick isn't a great driver. Sharapova isnt' a great tennis player. But, they make a lot of money. So, in many ways, the media , which is owned totally by men, who own most of the shares of the corporations, helps to hurt womens soccer and womens basketball which require a different tact media wise

Permalink Reply by Richard Murray on June 3, 2012 at 19:27

I am bold and say they should try them all. I don't know which would take up the call, but have any of them ever asked.

Lars Breimer said:

Fair points.  Which media do you think might take up cudgels for ladies´ soccer?  Cosmopolitan?  Elle?

Richard Murray said:

well the NFL has the NCAA which would be an illegal organization in Europe. You have to see, NFL teams get to have secret deals with NCAA clubs, some that bigger than NFL clubs in terms of Revenue but their financial data is very private and secret.
The WNBA is subsidized heavily by the NBA, but the WNBA's biggest problem is two fold. consider the top 10 female athletes by money. Only the Williams Sisters are true legends of their sport. Danica Patrick isn't a great driver. Sharapova isnt' a great tennis player. But, they make a lot of money. So, in many ways, the media , which is owned totally by men, who own most of the shares of the corporations, helps to hurt womens soccer and womens basketball which require a different tact media wise

Permalink Reply by 2xehxtxemyk65 on June 3, 2012 at 19:37

Probably the very best marketed female athlete of the past 10 years has been Magdalena Neuner. OK. The marketeers (there were two firms involved, allegedly) had great material to work with but they did not put a foot wrong and the result was spectacular.

High time for FIFA, UEFA and all the feminine FAs to hire marketeers who understand. Those with proven track records. Till that side of the game is perfected, ladies´ soccer will only be news when all else fails. They will be the Bengal tiger of the 2010s.

Richard Murray said:

I am bold and say they should try them all. I don't know which would take up the call, but have any of them ever asked.

Lars Breimer said:

Fair points.  Which media do you think might take up cudgels for ladies´ soccer?  Cosmopolitan?  Elle?

Richard Murray said:

well the NFL has the NCAA which would be an illegal organization in Europe. You have to see, NFL teams get to have secret deals with NCAA clubs, some that bigger than NFL clubs in terms of Revenue but their financial data is very private and secret.
The WNBA is subsidized heavily by the NBA, but the WNBA's biggest problem is two fold. consider the top 10 female athletes by money. Only the Williams Sisters are true legends of their sport. Danica Patrick isn't a great driver. Sharapova isnt' a great tennis player. But, they make a lot of money. So, in many ways, the media , which is owned totally by men, who own most of the shares of the corporations, helps to hurt womens soccer and womens basketball which require a different tact media wise

Permalink Reply by Richard Murray on June 3, 2012 at 21:02

good point

Lars Breimer said:

Probably the very best marketed female athlete of the past 10 years has been Magdalena Neuner. OK. The marketeers (there were two firms involved, allegedly) had great material to work with but they did not put a foot wrong and the result was spectacular.

High time for FIFA, UEFA and all the feminine FAs to hire marketeers who understand. Those with proven track records. Till that side of the game is perfected, ladies´ soccer will only be news when all else fails. They will be the Bengal tiger of the 2010s.

Richard Murray said:

I am bold and say they should try them all. I don't know which would take up the call, but have any of them ever asked.

Lars Breimer said:

Fair points.  Which media do you think might take up cudgels for ladies´ soccer?  Cosmopolitan?  Elle?

Richard Murray said:

well the NFL has the NCAA which would be an illegal organization in Europe. You have to see, NFL teams get to have secret deals with NCAA clubs, some that bigger than NFL clubs in terms of Revenue but their financial data is very private and secret.
The WNBA is subsidized heavily by the NBA, but the WNBA's biggest problem is two fold. consider the top 10 female athletes by money. Only the Williams Sisters are true legends of their sport. Danica Patrick isn't a great driver. Sharapova isnt' a great tennis player. But, they make a lot of money. So, in many ways, the media , which is owned totally by men, who own most of the shares of the corporations, helps to hurt womens soccer and womens basketball which require a different tact media wise

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