The Football Federation of Turkey continues to work towards reducing gender disparities.

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Comment by Gromit on August 4, 2012 at 19:08

Ok, that's definitely a dialogue of the deaf.

When I talk Football and Sports, you talk mathematics, again and again. Football is not mathematics. But you're a real mathematics lover obviously and you think that truth is hidden in numbers. I don't think that World's, Life's and Football's explanations are so simple. Certainly not.

We haven't, we don't and we won't progress in our dialogue, Lars. It's not very interesting. I know now it's impossible to keep on talking. So, I won't come and counter-argue with you on the subject because I have another idea of what a dialogue is. Not a repetition of the same all things again and again. Too bad because we obviously want the same thing at the end (or almost). But we must face the truth : real dialogue is impossible between us about this problem. You have too much certainties for me. I only have opinions and don't work with slogans, sorry.

Comment by Gromit on August 4, 2012 at 17:48

Thank you for teaching me the meaning of the word "solidarity", Lars, I didn't have the slightest idea ;o)

More seriously, I totally agree that Women's football will develop only if ladies go, play and watch it. Of course. And I don't want to be surrounded by men when watching a women's match, I prefer girls around me ;o)

What I am contesting is the - only - reason you invoke. This "solidarity" thing. You talked about it many times and already told us about middle, upper and working classes difference. But you never explained "WHY" women who are not interested in football "SHOULD" feel an urge for solidarity for Women's football.

Again, again, again : yes to women's solidarity if it's a question of Women's rights. Solidarity is needed amongst Iranian women because their sisters are forbidden to go and watch men's football games for instance. In some countries the practice of football is forbidden for women. It's a question of rights and freedom and you don't need to like football to express solidarity. Be a woman or a man, actually. It's no longer a question of sports.

But why, for which reasons, women should stand together, in Sweden or France for instance, just to help a sport they don't care and that all woman can freely practise, even if in bad conditions ? I asked you the question several times, you never answered. I wish  to see women in masses at ladies's football matches as much as you and managing teams and clubs, I'd love to see girls enjoying football because women's football is enjoyable.

I'm not contesting the need for women's players to be supported by as many women as possible. I just want to hear a precise reason why women should feel "obliged" to stand together for football. Only because they are women ? Is that what you say to your Swedish ladies fellows : "You must go to Women's football matches !" and if they tell you "Why ? I don't like football !", you'll only reply "It's a question of solidarity and that is all !. Is there your only argument to give them ? And make them feel guilty because they are middle-class ?

Please, dear Viking, give us something else to convince the ladies to go and watch their sisters playing. Because an ethical position repeated in a loop won't be, I'm afraid, enough.

Comment by Gromit on August 4, 2012 at 11:50

When the crowd in London stadium roars with delight at the vision of Jessica Innis's face, it's because she is British and because she is GB's champion mainly. And because it's Olympics. Do you think that a small pentathlon meeting in region at an other moment of the year would attract many women amongst others ?

The problem you already rose several times of "wome's solidarityn" with Ladies' Football is certainly generous but - sorry to be harsh - useless to my eyes. If you want women in the stadiums, make them love Football first. I'll never go and watch a sport that bore me to death, just by "solidarity" towards men. Why should I ? Women are the same. They don't want to go and get bored. Show them that Women's football is not boring but, on the contrary, very exciting and things could change. How to show them ?

First by interesting them right from the start or at least to give them the opportunity to get interested. By practising football at school when young kids. Even if they will never play it again, they will know that "Hey, it's not only a sport for men, after all..." 

Second, if they are already too old to be at school, by coupling women's matches with an other event that will be known for interesting women (it will vary according to countries, culture, etc). I'm talking here about amateur level. But it is from this level and not another one that roots can grow out and give future professional flowers.

The best way to send women away is to feel them guilty for  "lack of solidarity". You can call women's solidarity in some specific places where Football practice is strictly forbidden because the problem is political and about women's freedom. But where Women's football is legal - even with all its obtructions built by men mainly - you have to find other arguments, imho.
But in any case the first thing must be : Education, education, education !

About the use of money, of course it must be especially given to women's section and must not to be confiscated. FIFA must be  much more careful and sanctions delivered to the Federations who don't fulfill their obligations. But FIFA being itself deeply corrupted, what can we expect from it ? Can't wait for Blatter leaving. Hope Platini takes the position. I'm sure he would help Women's football very much.

Comment by Dağhan Irak on August 3, 2012 at 22:46

Lars, the problem is all income in Turkish football flows into a pool and distributed to departments from there. The share of grassroots projects in this pool is incredibly small (around 2%). Your suggestion is a fair one but TFF is a men's world and they wouldn't like to let their share go.

I just saw your other question by the way. Yes, Turkey has women referees, both in women's and men's leagues in all categories. Even a female referee (called Lale Orta) officiated games in men's Super League some years ago. Female referees are way ahead of women's football in Turkey. 

Comment by Women's Soccer United on August 3, 2012 at 22:43

Thank you Dağhan it is great to get a different view, I'm sad to hear that funds specified for the women's game is not being used there. 

Comment by Dağhan Irak on August 3, 2012 at 21:23

Well, I am Turkish and even though there are some nice people working quite hard to improve women's game in Turkey, I can say the real picture is much worse than portrayed here. The Directorship of Football Development has constantly been facing budget cuts and some funds coming from FIFA for women's football are used for men's football. The women's football budget is so small that the national team can't afford trials and camps at the same time, they have to choose one of them. If there wasn't UEFA Grassroots scheme at stake, I guess TFF board (fully composed of men) wouldn't bother to invest in women's game at all.

More on that later... 

Comment by Asa on August 2, 2012 at 13:27

Favourite comment : "Football is not a man's game"

Comment by Gromit on August 2, 2012 at 13:21

Thank you Asa. Great news coming from Turkey once more. A very good work is done over there. Keep going on, Turkey, the future is on your side ! :o)